Dawn Taylor|12/5/2022

Transcript

Dawn Taylor: [00:00:09] Hey, hey, hey. Welcome to the Taylor Way Talks the podcast where we dig deep into all those things we wish people talked about. My name is Dawn Taylor, the ass kicker and hope keeper of the Taylor Way, and I am your host. Today we have one of my favorite humans. I know that sounds crazy because I just met him. But I did his podcast long time ago and now he's here to do mine. His name is Jason and he is a loving husband, supportive dad, and avid gig economy hustler. And we are going to dive into why adult friendships are so incredibly hard. So stay tuned and hang out with us tonight.

Dawn Taylor: [00:00:49] Welcome to the show, Jason. How are you doing today?

Jason Tieri: [00:00:53] I am doing well. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be on your show as you were on mine long time ago. And I tried to peer pressure you to start a podcast because I think it was important. And here you are starting a podcast, so I'm pretty proud of you.

Dawn Taylor: [00:01:08] Oh, thank you. I had a blast on your show. If anyone wants to listen to it, go check it out. It's in on my website, TheTaylorWay.ca. And where would they find it on your end, Jason?

Jason Tieri: [00:01:18] Oh, you can just go to threads podcast dot com and then just click the episode link and I'm not sure which episode it is. I probably should have had that prepared before I came on.

Dawn Taylor: [00:01:29] That's okay. We'll put it in the show notes. We'll put it in the show notes for people if they're looking for it. So what is it you wished people were talking about?

Jason Tieri: [00:01:36] I wish people would talk about how hard it is to have adult friendships.

Dawn Taylor: [00:01:43] Amen brother.

Jason Tieri: [00:01:45] Yeah. I mean, I'm 46 and it's still a challenge for me. And I'm like, This should be easy by now. I mean, I've had a lot of years on this earth and I struggle with it at times.

Dawn Taylor: [00:01:59] Okay, so let's dive into this. So if anyone's listen to the episodes I've done before, they've heard we dive into like, what were we taught, right? Because that's a huge part of all these things is what we experience, what we were taught, what we were shown, and then how it shows up in our adult livelihood. So for you, what did your parents' relationships look like? What did friends look like when you were growing up in that way?

Jason Tieri: [00:02:22] You know, I knew you were going to ask kid stuff and I had, I don't know if we talked about it, but terrible upbringing. So it was a shit show. My parents didn't have, I mean, they didn't have a great relationship with me, so I can't imagine they had great ones when I was super young. But as I got a little bit older, I could see the writing on the wall. My mom was always losing friends because she has, she had mental health issues and those kind of things. And my dad seemed to keep some of the same friends. But like when you're married, too, it seems like at least in my parents' generation, they kind of like you hung out as couples, right? It didn't, there wasn't a lot of individual, at least for me. And so, you know, my mom would damage that relationship and then, you know, they would break up like, you know what I mean? Like, the whole couple would break up. So, yeah, that's kind of where I guess it came from for me. Obviously with the abuse, with me being younger, has really affected my relationships tenfold going forward. So that's part of the problem.

Dawn Taylor: [00:03:25] You know what? I totally agree. It's interesting and I've had this conversation with friends even recently is, like I was raised where my parents didn't go out and do a lot outside of couples hanging out with couples. It wasn't like my mom was all the time going to like wine Wednesdays or things like that that people do now. Do you know what I mean? Like they got, she would get together with like a cousin or friends and they'd craft or they'd visit while the kids played. It was not the same as what things are now, but coming from a background myself, with abuse and all kinds of different things, I've done a ton of research into even the inability to bond and how we bond in utero. And that for me has been a personal big struggle because I don't connect. I connect, but it's more of a chosen connection and I don't bond in the way most people bond. Then add to that the fact that I'm an empath and an introvert. It makes it really hard to maintain friendships. So what do you think for you, we'll start there. Are you an introvert, extrovert? Do you struggle to bond to people?

Jason Tieri: [00:04:38] I feel like as I've gotten older, I've become more of an introvert. I like to stay home and stuff like that, but I'm super social when I know you, like if I know you, you cannot shut me up. We're just having a good time. But I've kind of grown in my friendships as, like I said, I'm mid-forties. Younger, I had these friends that were the typical like bro friends, you know what I mean? Like, it's dick jokes and boobs and that's all you talked about, you know what I mean? Like, I mean, we're guys, right? Guys?

Dawn Taylor: [00:05:10] Totally.

Jason Tieri: [00:05:11] And then, you know, and then we would shit on each other and be just jerks. And then over time, I'm like, as I'm getting a little older, I'm like, Yeah, that's fun, But I don't want to... I want a little bit more of a deeper relationship. So I eventually got away from those friends just because they didn't want to go deep, I guess. I don't know.

Dawn Taylor: [00:05:35] It's part of that, do you think, the fear of vulnerability? Like you and I are close to the same age. And so we were raised in this era where there was not a heck of a lot of emotional intelligence, but it was also a time in life where, like I remember a situation, if my sister is listening, she's going to laugh at this or be mad at me again, but I lost it at my sister, reacted very, very, very badly in front of my mom, like a knife thrown across the house, kind of badly. Oh, yeah, it was real bad. And my mom was on the phone in the middle of it, and she was like, Oh hi, yeah. And as this, like, violent, like rip, like I'm talking like the battle to end battles is going on. I'll never forget to this day, at no point. And I mean, she was talking to one of her really close friends. At no point was she like, oh, I got to go, my kids are losing their crap right now. She was like, Hey, can I just call you back, in like the fakest voice ever, and there was this, like, weird pause there. I remember looking at her and thinking like, that could not have been more fake. Like, what was that? But I think looking forward from that, like, vulnerability is not a comfortable thing for the majority of people. So is that part of it? Those guys, it's like, no, no, no, dicks and boobs. We're good. We're good. This is as deep as this can go.

Jason Tieri: [00:07:03] But I think everyone has a story of growing up. I mean, nurturing is huge. I mean, as you know, your story about your mom, my mom was the same way. It was like, we're going to get, we're going to, shit's going to go down on Sunday, but when we go to church, it's going to be like, no, it's all good. You know what I mean? It's all good.

Dawn Taylor: [00:07:23] All going to act like the world is fine.

Jason Tieri: [00:07:25] Yeah, right. And so the friends I had, I don't know, like, maybe their parents didn't offer that emotional intelligence, as you talked about. Like, my mine really didn't. And so it's a, you know, mid seventies/eighties kids. And I think things have changed now, especially as I've raised my own kids. But yeah, I don't know, like I can't see any of those guys getting deep. I mean, I tried, you know, in quotes, "tried", I don't know if I was doing the right thing, but I mean, like, and I'm deep with my friends now, but it's not like, oh, gosh, it's not like I come to my friend and say, I literally have one friend, by the way, like a deep friend. So there's long stories with that. But I don't come and say, I want to get deep. You know, I just tell him my feelings. It's not like it's like, Oh, let's hug or anything like that. But I just say it how it is. Like, this is how it is. And that's emotional intelligence because I'm just telling them what my feelings are. So.

Dawn Taylor: [00:08:27] So is that, is part of it... and so I'm just like, my brain is rumbling through this right now. I read something that someone posted the other day on social media and it was like, what is a true friend? And someone posted this thing and I was like, Oh, that's just all horseshit. Like, that's a codependent, not healthy relationship. So could it be that we also don't understand what the definition of a friend is, or that there's different levels and layers, like I always use, like food as a metaphor for it. And I'm like, you know, you have your cotton candy friends, but like, you can't actually consist on a diet of cotton candy. So then you have like your meat and potatoes meal, but then you have like, Oh, I'm eating fruit. It's good, it's healthy for me, but I can only handle so much of it before it actually will send me into a diabetic coma. Do you know what I mean? Or like I can only have so many vegetables. Also good for me and a bit more substantial. But again, you can only eat so many before you're like, This is too much.

Jason Tieri: [00:09:25] Yeah, I... do you have a ride and die friend? You know what a ride and die is, right?

Dawn Taylor: [00:09:30] Oh, 100%.

Jason Tieri: [00:09:31] Yep. Like, I don't have that. I was, one of my friends, his wife is like a ride or die. Like, he went through a rough patch. He basically got ass-canned, and it was, he was a youth pastor. And he got ass-canned, but the passer told the church that he was moving on to other things. So it was this big like scandal. And she's like, I'm going to kill that pastor, like, and I'm like, Oh man, she is a ride or die. And I really don't have, I mean, I have a bunch of friends, but like, ride or Die is like, there's caveats to that, though. Like if you, if you hurt a family member I'm going to snitch on you, like, you know what I mean? But like, if anyone else and you're like, Hey, I got a body to bury, I'm like, All right, let's go. You know what I mean? That kind of ride or die? I don't know. I think of, like, biker groups. You know what I mean? Do you ever see Sons of Anarchy?

Dawn Taylor: [00:10:28] I saw like a few episodes of it.

Jason Tieri: [00:10:31] It's, it's very--

Dawn Taylor: [00:10:33] They're ride or die, though.

Jason Tieri: [00:10:34] Yeah. They're ride or die, like it does not matter what is going on with, if they're in that club like it's happening. So I always think of Sons of Anarchy for ride or die. But do you have a ride or die? I did ask that.

Dawn Taylor: [00:10:47] You know what, My ride or die is funny. I've had the same best friend since we were nine, but she was also born with the inability to bond. So we are, we've talked about how we have, like, the weirdest friendship on the planet because we're both each other's, like, chosen person. But we can go months without talking. We've had times where we've gone like a year without talking.

Jason Tieri: [00:11:15] Oh.

Dawn Taylor: [00:11:16] And we both are like, So you're still my person? Yep, still your person. We're like, Yeah, okay, cool. And like, but we actually, like, have to check in once in a while, which I find really hilarious. But she's the person who - and I've said this before to people - like, she's not the person you call when you're having a bad day. Because she doesn't process her emotions in the same way as anyone else I've ever met in my entire life. So there's like zero empathy. Like she'll have some sympathy, but then she's like, Yeah, okay, what are you doing about it? Which is not the person you want to call an emergency, but she's the person that you know is always going to be there and always is going to love you. And I'll pray for you if you're having a bad day and like you can say those things. But she is my biggest challenger. Like, hands down my biggest challenger. So she's the one that, for example, when I was dyeing my hair for years because I had gone grey when I was about 21, 22. After the brain aneurysm, I had gone grey. And I dyed my hair every three weeks at a hairdressers for the next ten years. And my husband and I were talking about it one day and we'd calculated that I had spent over $25,000 keeping my hair from being gray. Yes. Yes. Your jaw should be dropping because it's an atrocious amount of money. But I have such a ridiculous amount of hair, it's baby fine, so I couldn't box dye it or it wrecked it. So it was just an expense. Like it was a line item in our budget that I went and got my hair done. And him and I were talking about it and he's like, What if you just let it go gray and see what it looks like? And I mean, this is my natural hair. Like, this is just my crazy grey, it turned out well for me. But when I called her and I talked to her about it, this is how she responds: Not just like, yeah, you should totally just like, let it go and see what happens. Or no, you should keep going. This was her exact response, and I'll never forget it. She's like, Are you dyeing your hair to hide and not stand out in a crowd? Or are you dyeing your hair because it actually authentically makes you feel more like you prior to the aneurysm? Because you need to check your intentions first. Like she's that friend. And I was like, Oh. Okay. Right? So then when I realized that, like, yes, I was dyeing my hair to fit in and feel more quote/unquote normal, then I was like, Yeah, okay, I need to actually just let it go gray and roll with it and see what happens. Like, she's that friend. She's not the friend that you are just like, Hey, how's the weather? Like, she couldn't care less. Like it's like, insta deep. It's a totally weird friendship, though.

Jason Tieri: [00:13:52] Yeah, it sounds like a very therapist response. Like, you know what I mean is, are you trying to make yourself feel better and whatever she said, and I'm just like, that's something my therapist would say.

Dawn Taylor: [00:14:05] Well, and that's where she's like, where I said, like, she's my challenger.

Jason Tieri: [00:14:09] Yeah. And you need those people.

Dawn Taylor: [00:14:10] Totally. So she's like my meat and potatoes where I have a friend here who is, she's one of my favorite people. But we, because of childhood, because of levels of trauma, because of different things, it'll never be the same as relationship A. Do you know what I mean? But she's probably the person I could phone and be like, Hey, I killed someone. And she'd be like, Yeah, cool. I got a shovel where we going? Like, she's more that person, but fairly new. Like we've known each other for five years.

Jason Tieri: [00:14:44] Yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:14:45] So, yeah, I know. I look at my sister. My sister has, like the most amazing set of friends and the same friends for a million years, and they help each other with everything. And I'm always like, What does that feel like? What does that look like?

Jason Tieri: [00:15:00] As far as like females go, my wife struggles to have good, close friends and I, like, when we first got together, I had always been like the jealous type. And so when we first got together, she had some friends and then I kind of wrecked that. You know, I was young and, well, no, I wasn't young, I just had not had therapy yet. So that was my problem. I can't say that I was young because I wasn't young, but...

Dawn Taylor: [00:15:26] Young emotionally, put it that way.

Jason Tieri: [00:15:30] Well, yeah. And then I'm a male, too, so it's like it doesn't even hit until like 30 anyways, so. But yeah, and to the point where I would have to tell her I'm like, you need to go out with some friends, like, go find some friends. And she's a big one that struggles with connecting with people, which she's so emotional too, like, she's the exact opposite of me. So I guess it's two ends of the spectrum. Like you can be, like, you can't bond or you're an introvert or you can be like, she's super social, everyone loves her at work, but she just can't find those deep connections and she hasn't quite figured it out. We've talked about it, but I don't know. I wish she had like a super best friend because she always says like, Oh, I'm so stressed out and if I can't talk to you, I only can talk to my therapist. I'm like, Oh man, I wish you had a best friend. Not that I don't want to talk to her about it, but sometimes I can't help. You know, I'm the problem, probably.

Dawn Taylor: [00:16:23] Right? Right. I think your spouse and your best friend need to be two different people. Like my husband is 100% hands down my very, very best friend in the world. But I still have other people I can talk to and my other friends. So, funny question, but what are your expectations of a friend? What do you need from a friend?

Jason Tieri: [00:16:44] So I'm going to - you know what spill the tea is?

Dawn Taylor: [00:16:47] Kind of.

Jason Tieri: [00:16:48] I have a 14 year old daughter, so it's like gossip. You don't probably know this, and, but anyways, when when we recorded with you, it was with Ben.

Dawn Taylor: [00:16:57] Yeah.

Jason Tieri: [00:16:58] And he is not part of the show anymore, and he's not part of my life anymore.

Dawn Taylor: [00:17:02] Really?

Jason Tieri: [00:17:04] Yeah. We had a huge falling out. I mean, like, stomp away from the table, like he just walked away and it kind of has to do with your question, your expectations. So I think we were never made to be friends. And I think the podcast, I tried to work on it more because of that, but his expectation for my friendship is like, I like to have fun and tease, right? But I also, my expectation is I also want that emotional connection. Well, we were kind of having that emotional connection, but he was struggling with the teasing and having fun and and there's a lot more to the story than that, but...

Dawn Taylor: [00:17:46] Oh, totally.

Jason Tieri: [00:17:46] I just wanted to let you know that he's not part of it. And obviously Threads is still going, obviously. But I brought another host on who was actually going to come out as the third host, and that's when Ben blew up. So it's a big...

Dawn Taylor: [00:17:58] Oh no.

Jason Tieri: [00:18:01] And this third host had been on the show like six times and he went to college with Ben. Like this was going to be this like, awesome, like three person pod. And then it just blew up. It didn't happen. But yeah, he had, Ben had said to me, like, you can't tease me. You can't like, he didn't even like jokes, you know what I mean? And I'm like, I can't have a friend like that. Like, I just can't do that. I need both. I need to be able to connect with you and say, I'm having a really bad mental health, like I am messed up today and I really need to talk. And I also need to be like, you know, like dick jokes, like, I like to have fun, you know, it's the whole point.

Dawn Taylor: [00:18:43] I need to be able to say I'm melting and say a your mama joke in the same sentence.

Jason Tieri: [00:18:46] Yeah. You know, honestly, since Mike has come on the show, it's so much more fun. I'm having so much more fun.

Dawn Taylor: [00:18:53] Oh, good.

Jason Tieri: [00:18:54] We joke a lot, but we still get deep, and I do miss Ben. I think he was a good part of my life for those years. And I really, it's a shame that it happened, but again, hard friendships, like he walked away. He recently just texted me - this happened in January - and he's like, I'm thinking I might want to reconnect. And I texted back, I'm all set, you know what I mean? Because like, I'm done with you. Like early on, if you would have reached out within the first 90 days, I might be like, Hey, let's work on this.

Dawn Taylor: [00:19:26] But you're like eight months later?

Jason Tieri: [00:19:28] Yeah. I'm like, No, no response. No, tell me. I mean, a few emails, but just like none of it, and all of a sudden you want to reconnect again? And I'm just, maybe some day, but I'm just like, I'm good, I'm good. So anyways, my expectations. That was a long story to get to answer your question, but is that, is the emotional connection, the emotional intelligence, and still be able to have fun and and not worry that I'm going to hurt your feelings, unless I did and then Mike, again, my friend, would say hey you know this hurt my feelings.

Dawn Taylor: [00:20:06] So do you have, because this is something that I've, people laugh at me because in a new friendship I'm like, okay, so let's talk expectations.

Jason Tieri: [00:20:15] Right away?

Dawn Taylor: [00:20:16] Oh, like really early. Like we've maybe hung out twice and I like, lay it out. I'm like the person who, I just lay it out. So I'm very big on like, okay, what are your expectations of me? When it comes to your birthday, I probably won't remember it. So do you need me to remember it? Do you need me to throw you a party? Do you need me to call you and serenade you and buy you an expensive gift? Like what do you need from me? How often do we need to text? How often do we need to talk? How often do we need to hang out? Like, what do you need from me? Because I will take someone out with my car. I will fight to the death for you. I will be the first person there in an emergency. Like I will move the mountains for you if you are one of my friends, you're my person. But I need to know what your expectations are of me so that I can tell you in advance if I'm going to just incredibly disappoint you or not. And people, people laugh. They're like, seriously? And I'm like, Yeah, I need to know. And they're like, Why? And I'm like, Because I am the world's shittiest friend. And I'm very aware of this fact. And this is literally, literally the conversation I have with people is, I am the world's worst friend and I am very aware of that. And it's very hard to be my friend sometimes. And so I just want to lay it out in advance so that you know what you're walking into because there's the door. And it's really interesting how many people actually stick around. Because they're like, You're hilarious and the easiest friend to have because we know exactly what you need and want from us. But it's a thing, and it's been really interesting over the years, having people in my life that are like, You haven't called me all week. And I'm like, No. I haven't. And it might take me another month to call you. But I thought you were my really good friend. And I'm like, Yeah, and I laid it out when we started. And I think that for me, there's like a weird threshold of like I need very little in a relationship to consider someone a close friend. Like, I have such low expectations of people that I'm always pleasantly surprised by people, which is why I lay it out so abruptly. But I've definitely lost a lot of friends over it because I can't meet their expectations of what they have of me.

Jason Tieri: [00:22:41] Yeah, I first of all, that's incredible. Probably people love it mostly because they want to do it and they just don't have the balls or or, you know, excuse my French. I don't know. It's such a woke world now, I figure you're not like that. And I am pretty woke, but like, balls. I'm like, Oh, that's offensive because it talks about male genitalia, not female.

Dawn Taylor: [00:23:03] Oh, gosh, it's okay. I had that today when I was, like, someone was talking to me about starting coaching and I was like, No, no, you need your time at home with your baby. And they're like, That was a weird, awkward pause. And I was like, I didn't know if I could say, like, your son or daughter. Like, I actually genuinely didn't know if I was allowed. And she started laughing and was like, It's okay, it's my daughter. And I was like, Oh, okay, we're good. Like, I felt so bad because I don't want to like, I'm always like, I don't want to get in trouble, but I don't actually know how to be politically correct these days.

Jason Tieri: [00:23:31] Yeah, it's a weird time. Like I said, I lean to the left, but I often wonder when I say stuff like if I can come across....

Dawn Taylor: [00:23:40] You can say balls.

Jason Tieri: [00:23:41] Yeah, I know. I just wonder if I come across as like, I've really... total digression. If you can see my flag right here is upside down. That is my protest to, you know, what's been going on in the Supreme Court in America and stuff like that. But I just stopped wearing my American hat flag because people thought I was a Trumper. Like, I got this giant beard and I have tats all over my arm. And I literally, people thought I was a Trumper and I'm just like... anyways, I could go on. It's such a random, I could go on and on about this frickin country right now, but...

Dawn Taylor: [00:24:16] We'll do a second podcast on that. No, but the whole expectation.

Jason Tieri: [00:24:20] Yeah. So that kind of sounds like boundaries to me. And I have really worked on setting boundaries with my family. Now, when I say my family, the family I grew up with, which I literally don't talk to, well my younger sister I do. But the expectation thing, so when you say that to people, what if they have expectations for you that you're like, I can't do that? Do you just say we can't be friends or This is what I can do and if you don't like it, then I'm not sure we can be friends? I mean.

Dawn Taylor: [00:24:49] 100% I do. So I will actually say that and I will, I'm very not blunt because it's done out of love. But I always talk about how like expectations of somebody, you're setting them up for failure and yourself up for disappointment constantly. And so I'll say, Look, I can't ever be that person for you. At no point in time am I going to text you every day, never mind five times a day, at no point in time am I going to call you even maybe once a week? And I might come in and out. And I just like, I need you to know that, like, I can try to step it up because I know that this thing is important to you. And then I can choose that, right? I can choose to shift my behaviors. And I have, like I have some friends that certain things mean a lot to them. And so I will make sure I do those things. Where other people I'm like, I'll never be the friend you need me to be. So I'm totally willing to try, but I will forever disappoint you.

Jason Tieri: [00:25:54] But early on, like, I'm always wanting to have new friends, so I would never do that so early because I'd be like, What if it's the one? What if it's the the ride or die? You know what I mean? So, no, I would definitely down the road, like if things started getting quote/unquote weird, like, you know, the person was like, how come you haven't texted me? I'm like, okay, we need to set some expectations here. You know what I mean? And then I would say, Well, maybe he's not the one. I know it sounds weird, but yeah, I would think I would want to wait before I'd be like, lay it out. Because if you did that to me, I would be like, Yeah, whatever, dude. Like, wow, you got, you need to see your therapist today or something, right? I mean, just be like, it was such a like, or I've thought I would say, Man, she's really got her shit together. She's seen her therapist and she is not messing around. So, you know, keep an eye on her, too, you know?

Dawn Taylor: [00:26:46] Well, I think for me, part of it is being an introvert. I only have so much energy in a day and I only have so much energy in a week. And so I have to be very, very cautious to guard my mental, emotional, physical energy. I have to be so careful with that. And maybe that sounds really awful if I know in advance I'm going to disappoint you. But also if my bluntness or my abruptness or my confidence... my husband's like, No, you're just ridiculously confident is what it is.

Jason Tieri: [00:27:23] Yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:27:25] If that's going to offend you that early, you're probably not gonna last as a friend to begin with. Right? But because I only have so much energy, like, I had someone reach out because they want to go for lunch. And I was like, Yeah, I'm booking like last week of September. And they were like, What? And I was like, No, I'm literally booking last week of September. And they're like, Okay, weirdo. But yeah, let's do it. Let's book it, because I know that I can only handle like so many friend dates in a week or so many coffees or so many lunches or so many dinners. And part of it is like protecting my physical health, having dealt with this thyroid disease stuff this last year, and I have very little extra energy at the end of the day. Yeah, I think that's part of it, right, is like are you feeding me or are you taking from me? And that will determine when and where you can fit. So there's some people in my life, if they were to call me today and be like, Hey, do you have an hour? I'm going on a road trip this week, next week. And if they were to be like, Hey, do you have an hour, I want to go for coffee this week, I'd be like, Oh, hell yeah, let's fit that in, because I know that that's going to be like an equally beneficial time together. But I don't know, maybe I'm like, weirdly calculated in my friends.

Jason Tieri: [00:28:44] No, what I hear now that you've explained it a little bit more, is that you're very aware of your bandwidth. I call it my bandwidth. You know what I mean? You're very aware of that and you're like--

Dawn Taylor: [00:28:55] -- crazy aware.

Jason Tieri: [00:28:56] -- can't happen because then I'm going to not be a good, good wife or whatever, or a good coach or good friend to the friends that you already have. And it might sound mean to them and they might get pissed off, but you're just like, This is how it is. Like my mental health is more important than trying to please everyone and you just never going to please everyone, so.

Dawn Taylor: [00:29:18] Well, I think I'm okay with that. As weird as that sounds, I'm very okay with the fact that I'll never make everyone happy. Like, it's not possible. So I've just, I've removed that expectation of myself and my world.

Jason Tieri: [00:29:32] I feel like you had to just shorten that down to, like, a nametag, something that you can put on a button and just walk around with the button. Or you could just say F Off. I mean, that would be short and sweet.

Dawn Taylor: [00:29:46] It's funny because the people in my life that are my people, like when I choose you as my person, you're my person, right? If I choose to have you in my life as a friend, you're in. And then I'm actually quite good. But it's really funny because they all laugh. They're like, You are so funny. Like, I'm the first person, like, you're having a bad day, I'm going to, like, make sure you're fed. I'm going to make sure you get a gift. I'm going to make sure that, like, do you need your house clean? Like, what do you need? How can I support you? I'm here. I'm not joking when I say I'm that girl in an emergency. I'm like, Let's do this.

Jason Tieri: [00:30:23] I struggle with friends and what I hear from you is you don't. Like what, what do you what do you struggle with friends or what do they do that you struggle with, that you're just like, Oh, I can't do it. Like I said, mine with Ben, it was just I couldn't have fun with him, you know? But with Mike, it seems like I can have fun and connection. So I'm just wondering, you know, it sounds like you have everything laid out perfectly, so you must have these perfect friendships.

Dawn Taylor: [00:30:53] I wish. You know what, my biggest struggle, my absolute biggest struggle is not having the time or the energy that people need from me. So even within those friendships, it's still like, as much as like the majority of me is like, no, I really don't care if I disappoint you because that's actually just life and you need to accept that, it's still the actual action of like, Oh my goodness, let's go do this thing. And I'm like, No, tapped out, can't. I find that super hard. I also weirdly attract extroverts that don't have a deep level of trauma, which is like the polar, which is the polar opposite of me. And so I personally struggle with feeling like I have to hide a lot of who I am, because I grew up feeling like I was too much for people. Like my story's too big or I'm too much or I'm too extreme or something like that. Like I had a newer friend this week, she's like, What I know about you so far is like everything in your life is a massive extreme and everything you do is done really big. And I was like, Fuck, she saw me. And that was like my initial response, which was really hilarious because nothing she was saying was said with an ill intention or anything. And I was like, Wow, I actually let my guard down with somebody. Like that was really, really surprising to me. And so that's one of the areas that I struggle in.

Jason Tieri: [00:32:26] I think we're kind of alike. I do things big, like.

Dawn Taylor: [00:32:30] My whole world is like that.

Jason Tieri: [00:32:33] If I'm going to do it, I'm just going to do it big. And I actually, this whole podcasting gig has been the longest thing I've spent time on because my wife always jokes like, I get 1000 hobbies and I go big on them and I'm hard and fast. And then it's like--

Dawn Taylor: [00:32:48] -- and then you peter out. 100%. I'm the same.

Jason Tieri: [00:32:51] I know. But this podcasting thing, like, this is like all I do right now. And my wife is like... Man, I've been doing this since 2017. And yeah, I think it's the first time I've actually not, I've gone big, that's for sure. But too big at times. Well I'm kind of glad that you told me that. Like and it's funny that you said, oh I'm being, oh, they found out, but that's you,that's being vulnerable. That's a connection point with somebody. They're like, Oh, yeah, like, okay, maybe this person is the person that I can connect with.

Dawn Taylor: [00:33:26] And I, yeah, I find that this year I've really been shifting my intentions. For anyone listening, in, even in just building relationships - and this is a big piece of advice I would give anyone - is shift your intentions behind even the time you're spending with people. So I set goals at weird times of year. And so my goal setting is typically for September 1st. This is my time of year, I set all my goals. Because if I do January 1st, like the majority of people, then I'm like mid-November, I'm like, January is coming, life's busy, it's fair, whatever. And then I just kind of like coast for a solid like six weeks till the end of the year. And then January 1st, it's like, who actually wants to restart their goals on January 1st? Nobody. So if I start in September when the energy is still high and motivation is going and there's like the excitement of the back to school and, you know, the weather changes and all those things, I find that it's so much easier for me when it comes to my goals in life. And so one of mine this year, though, with friendships was I'm not going to do the Hey, we should do coffee. Hey, we should set up that lunch. So I have a bunch of people in my world now where... I actually, like, it's in our calendars, like every four weeks we go for breakfast. Or every four weeks we're meeting for lunch. So it's not even super often, it's a completely attainable amount. But it has completely shifted even our conversations within those dates. Because we know that we're going to do another one. And now it's turning into like, Hey, what's all gone down in the last month? And there's an excitement for what the next one's going to be. And it's fun when it, like, gets bumped up to like three weeks because you're like, No, I want to see you, let's, like, bump it up a little bit.

Jason Tieri: [00:35:14] Yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:35:15] And so that's one of the things that I have shifted this year is when someone's like, Oh my goodness, we should do... I'm like, Yeah, no, let's book it now.

Jason Tieri: [00:35:23] Yes, that is awesome.

Dawn Taylor: [00:35:26] Like pull out your calendar. And if people are like, Oh, I'm like, Oh, so you weren't serious? Okay.

Jason Tieri: [00:35:32] Yes. You're like you just call them to the table. You're like, okay, bro. Like you, I guess, you know, I do the same thing. I'm like, Mike, I'm like, pick a date. Like, he is terrible with that, too. It drives me bonkers. Like, we're going to supposed to do a fire in September, and I've asked him twice. I'm like, I'm giving you every available Saturday in September. Pick one, please. Oh, I'll talk to Natalie, blah, blah. I'm like, Oh, it's so frustrating for me. But yeah, no, that is super good to do that because then it like doesn't, I think what happens sometimes when you don't do that, then which person is responsible for the one to reach out to actually book that. So then it eliminates that. We're like, yep, let's put it in right now, you put it in and then we're both responsible for making the date. And it's not this weird, awkward, like, Oh, she never texted me. And then one gets pissed because they didn't. And I'm talking about my wife, I'm thinking about a scenario, like, they struggle with that too. I'm like, for Christ's sake, just put it on your calendar, right? Like, reschedule it right there, like I do. I got my haircut today. I rescheduled my six weeks, like, boom, Like, that's just what you need to do.

Dawn Taylor: [00:36:43] We do it with everything else, but we don't with our relationships. And another thing that I've really looked at this year is going Ok the people that really matter. So if I'm looking at like my core few people that I'm like, No, no, I actively want to improve this relationship. This is one that I really want to improve. One of the things that I've really been looking at is, okay, what do they need? So what are their expectations? But like, what do they need? So I have one friend who we have like a regular every Friday we were meeting to go to the farmers market, and it was our quick little like 45 minutes walk around our groceries, it was just our little thing, but it was just this amazing connection point in a week. But I knew the minute summer hit - and this is where it comes down to expectations, right - I knew the second summer hit, girl is going to be at the lake. Like nine of the ten Fridays, if I'm like, Oh, here, we still good in the morning, she'll be like, Oh, no, I went camping. Like, I know this about her too. She is. But it's not that she's rejecting me. It's not that she's pushing me away. It's not any of those things because we like to attach stories to people's actions.

Jason Tieri: [00:38:00] Yes.

Dawn Taylor: [00:38:01] And so I looked at that and I was the one who was like, Hey, why don't we cancel our farmers markets for the summer knowing you're going to be gone the whole time? But then I actually said the words. I was like, You know, I love you. I know you love me. Let's see if we can catch a lunch or two this summer. But then let's start again in September when you're ready, just let me know when you're back from camping. Guess who texted today because her kids school started today and she's like, so Friday farmer's market? And I laughed and was like, Yeah, okay, let's make it happen.

Jason Tieri: [00:38:34] Perfect.

Dawn Taylor: [00:38:35] But I think that's part of it is, like, releasing people of the expectations that we have of them that are so tied to ourselves. So for her, I'm not going to be like, No, we had that scheduled, so if you cancel that on me, you're dead to me. Do you know what I mean? Like I'm not going to go there because it's not even her personality and it's not an attack against me.

Jason Tieri: [00:38:57] How are you so, like, not selfish? Like if you grew up in, like, shitty, like me and my sisters, we're all selfish. Like, I feel like I had neglect and those kind of things and the abuse and stuff. And it sounds like you're just so giving, within your limits, of course.

Dawn Taylor: [00:39:18] Oh, healthy boundaries.

Jason Tieri: [00:39:19] And healthy boundaries. But I just, I struggle with that. Like, you were really thinking about your friend and I would be a little fussy. I'd be like, This is bullshit. Like, we had this date every week. You're like, No, I'm going to I'm going to be like, proactive, and I know she's, you know, is going camping. And I don't know, I just, I applaud you for that because I really struggle not thinking beyond myself sometimes.

Dawn Taylor: [00:39:46] You know, the biggest part is that I'm not afraid of my shit. I'm not afraid of it. Like, people laugh at me. So I'm leaving on Friday, no, Saturday morning I'm getting in my car and I'm like, Oh, okay, time to face some demons, time to face some fears. Let's make this happen. I am the first person to be like, Ooh, found a scab, let's pick it and figure out what's going on underneath it.

Jason Tieri: [00:40:13] Yes, I'm a scab picker.

Dawn Taylor: [00:40:15] Like I am the first person to be like, ooh. Ooh, that feel wasn't good. What was that? We got to dig into that and figure out where that came from and what that was. And so I'm literally doing a two week, 7000 kilometer road trip by myself, pushing myself out of my comfort zone every single day, facing my physical fears, my mental fears, my emotional fears, my demons. Like, no, it's going to be brutal and amazing. But I'm the person who was willing to do that. And the biggest thing for me is looking at it and going, okay, if I can actually look at this with no judgment and just curiosity, what's really going on here? And so being raised the way that I was and with the abuse and the traumas and all of the craziness that's gone on in my life, I think part of it is I have fought so hard to not be who I was raised by. And I sat in that car as my parents would spend every summer driving across Canada to visit all the friends and all the family and stop every night at someone's house. But it was interesting because, like, they would do it, but then they'd get in the vehicle and bitch about it from that destination to the next destination. Right? Like the amount of times I heard, like, you know, the road's the same distance both ways. Like, all this effort, we're putting in, right. Like it was this constant complaint. And I remember sitting there as a kid being like, So why the hell are we doing this? Can't we just stay home? And so out of rebellion of that, right? Like, my parents were super indecisive, I became too decisive. My parents were, you know, maybe like super high expectations on all the people around them, and I was like, I'm going to have none and let people surprise me. Right? So a lot of it comes from that. Like, a lot of it comes from that. But also this, like really big like, huh, there's a really giant feel around something that makes no sense. I wonder where that came from.

Jason Tieri: [00:42:19] That's incredible.

Dawn Taylor: [00:42:21] Like, I really spend a lot of time digging into that. So when somebody says something, when that person reacted, when that new friend said what she said, and my initial reaction is like, fuck, like I freak out. I was like, well, that was a big feel. Like, where did that come from? But then if I'm not judging my reaction and I'm not judging the feeling and I'm not judging her for what she said, and I'm like, there's no judgment on it. I'm just curious. Then I could look at it and be like, but what about me is so scary? What am I scared of her seeing? Why? Why am I hiding? Like, what specifically am I hiding from her? And it was like this feeling of being too much. And then I could look at it and go, okay, if you are too much, there's almost 8 billion more people on the planet. I'm sure you can find someone else who will think you're perfectly enough. Yeah, but the second thing is, at any point in time, did she say I was too much? Or did she actually just point out something that was complete truth about you?

Jason Tieri: [00:43:28] Oh, yeah, that's hard.

Dawn Taylor: [00:43:29] And so then in that I could be like, Oh, no, that actually just had to do with me. And now I can decide how much more I want to put out there or show or not show or like, my level of vulnerability with her.

Jason Tieri: [00:43:42] Yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:43:43] And I think that's why I can react the way I do to people.

Jason Tieri: [00:43:48] Yeah, that's crazy that you can do that. I'm jealous of that. Being more curious is a pain point for me, as people say, that I'm not curious enough and I end up having trouble with my friends because I shoot my mouth off. Oh, man.

Dawn Taylor: [00:44:10] I don't know, though. Like, if you were to look at it, though, and go, How can I love you even more right now? Like that statement, even just try that with your family, right when you're going into a situation. I can I can look at my siblings, I can look at my friends, I can look at my husband. Good grief. We can look at anyone around us and judge them.

Jason Tieri: [00:44:31] Oh, yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:44:31] Like we can always find something to not like about a person and then hold them responsible for whatever's going on in our lives because of it. But, I don't know. I find the more I just get curious, and whether it's with my own life or somebody else's, the more I've... well put it this way, the more curious I've gotten about my own life and the less and less judgment I have on my own world, the more healing I can get at a faster pace, which then allows me then to be like, okay, so if I can just get curious about me, what's stopping me from just getting curious about someone else?

Jason Tieri: [00:45:08] Yeah, that's amazing that you can do that. It sounds like you've done a lot, done a lot of work around that.

Dawn Taylor: [00:45:16] A lot of work. It's a muscle, though. Like, seriously, you should try it. It's just a muscle. It's a muscle where every time I find myself going to that place of like the condemnation, you know, like that judge feel. And I always, I always stop myself and go, Oh, no judgment, just curiosity. If I was to look at this through a lens of no judgment, just curiosity, how different would it look?

Jason Tieri: [00:45:41] Yeah, it's funny you say that that's a muscle. It's, it really is. It's just something like the attitude of gratitude, right? You have to work on that. And then we always talk about with our kids around Christmas and Thanksgiving and then it goes away. But yeah, that is something. I know it does. Fricking kids. They live a great frickin life, man. I don't know, I spoil them too much, probably because... Yeah, well, we know from my childhood. But yeah, that's so interesting that you say it's like a muscle because it's like a habit that you have to keep doing, and then over time it's just like, oh, is that, am I, am I mad at that person or am I just, do I need to be more curious instead of like, freaking out about it, you know? But that's, that's cool.

Dawn Taylor: [00:46:33] Well, and the other question I always ask is, was this my expectation of them or was this their expectation of themselves.

Jason Tieri: [00:46:41] Usually yours?

Dawn Taylor: [00:46:42] Because if you look at it when it comes to like morals, ethics, values and standards, that totally like, look up the definitions of those, is super interesting to see like, oh, that's actually someone's standard that they've set for themselves on what is or isn't appropriate in their life. And then you can decide, like, is that something that I'm okay with? Can I handle that in a friend? I can handle a friend who changes their plans nonstop. I can handle a friend who doesn't talk to me for a year and then shows up out of the blue and is like, and they're there and they're like, Let's be friends. I'm like, I can totally handle that. I have zero issues with that. Just because I'm like that. Like, I'm totally okay with that. But I know a lot of people that aren't.

Jason Tieri: [00:47:28] I'm not.

Dawn Taylor: [00:47:31] No. And you don't have to be is the thing. Its just finding people that have, like, similar standards of themselves.

Jason Tieri: [00:47:38] Oh, that's such a good point. But like, we only got this short life, though. I mean, how many, how many failed friendships am I going to have before I find the one?

Dawn Taylor: [00:47:47] So what is it you're looking for in a friend to fix?

Jason Tieri: [00:47:51] No, not for them to fix. But like you said, you know, trying to find people with the same standards, like someone that maybe doesn't care that you don't connect. But also, do you want those same people like a high strung friend? That's another high strung friend, you're just going to kill each other. You know what I mean? I get what you're saying about the same standards, but I feel like that's super hard to find.

Dawn Taylor: [00:48:14] Well, I think it comes down to not... How many standards do you have?

Jason Tieri: [00:48:19] Yeah, that's true.

Dawn Taylor: [00:48:21] Like, if you're going into a relationship and you're like, Oh, heads up, these are my 45 values and these are my 73 expectations, and here's my list of 597 standards that you have to meet, like if you're looking at it like a Tinder thing, right? Where it's like, Oh, they don't meet all of my expectations. Or if you're like, you know what? This is one area that I know of that's a huge trigger for me, is if you ghost me.

Jason Tieri: [00:48:47] Yeah, that's fair.

Dawn Taylor: [00:48:49] Then you could be like, then you can pay attention. And if you talk, if you're talking to someone and you realize that all of their friends are current, like every single one of their friends is current, in the last three months, you're like, Oh, this person loses friends a lot.

Jason Tieri: [00:49:02] Yes.

Dawn Taylor: [00:49:03] Then you, then like, you can pick up on those red flags to be like, Oh, yeah, No, no, no, this makes sense. This person's going to ghost me at some point. So how much energy am I willing to put into it? Where if you look at a friend who has like 50 friends that they've had for 20 plus years and it's not even a thing, you're like, Oh yeah, this person will stick by you through all your shit. Like, it takes a lot to lose this person as a friend. I think I'm going to put effort there.

Jason Tieri: [00:49:31] That's fair. That's fair. I often wonder, too, though, how many friends do you need? You know what I mean? Like, I have my one friend now and I mean I have other friends, but like, they're not like I talk to every day, you know, like I text him every day, but I try not to be the crazy girlfriend and text them too much. I try to give him the space because he wants his space, you know what I mean? But again, how many friends do you need? Like I, you know, I'm fine with just the one right now, but then you worry like, oh, man, what happens if it doesn't work out? I mean, I don't actually worry about that, but I mean, after what happened with Ben, I'm a little like, oh, a little gun shy going into friendships right now. But I don't know, I guess there's probably not a magic number of how many friends you really do need.

Dawn Taylor: [00:50:16] I think everyone's different. Someone described it to me one time as like a Lego brick. Some people just have like that one little tiny square and they have like one little knob. That's it. Like they can have, they have one friend that's like their compartment that they can put towards friends. Another person might have a six piece, another person might have a twelve piece. It doesn't make any of the Lego pieces wrong or broken or something like bad. It's just everyone has a different capacity of what they can handle.

Jason Tieri: [00:50:43] Yeah, that makes sense.

Dawn Taylor: [00:50:45] I think that's okay. Maybe it is and maybe that's beautiful and okay. I don't have, I don't have a ton of close friends. And I'm okay with that.

Jason Tieri: [00:50:57] Yeah, I'm okay with it, too. Sometimes you wonder if you need more because that one's not filling your bucket that day or whatever. And I wish I had another friend that I could bounce something off to. But anyways. Yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:51:12] I mean, you can always start actively looking.

Jason Tieri: [00:51:14] Oh, gosh. Is there, is there an app for that, for friends?

Dawn Taylor: [00:51:18] Hilariously, I think Bumble does that now. Don't they?

Jason Tieri: [00:51:20] No!

Dawn Taylor: [00:51:22] Yeah. Bumble has like a whole friends category where it's actually just people looking for friends. That have similar likes, similar stuff. It's way bigger in the States. I've heard in Canada, it's kind of pathetic. Probably because there's no people in Canada.

Jason Tieri: [00:51:38] Right. That's actually not a bad idea because like, you know, with Facebook, there's a bunch of like Grand Rapids, or I'm from Grand Rapids, but like the Grand Rapids Informed and people are on they're like, yeah, I'm just, I'm looking for a friend. I always think of them as losers. Like, oh, gosh, they're like a psycho. They're going to kill me. But maybe they just want to have somebody that likes car racing or basketball or stuff like that. And I'm like, Why don't you just be a normal person, just get on Reddit. Don't, I don't want to meet you in person.

Dawn Taylor: [00:52:12] I love it. Jason, we should just be friends.

Jason Tieri: [00:52:16] Yes.

Dawn Taylor: [00:52:18] Let's do it. I'll disappoint you. I'm just warning you right now.

Jason Tieri: [00:52:23] Hey. You've set the expectations, so... Are you one that doesn't return text messages, though?

Dawn Taylor: [00:52:29] Oh, no, I totally return texts and calls.

Jason Tieri: [00:52:32] Thank you. Well, don't call me. If you call me, I'm not picking up. I hate talking on the phone. I hate it.

Dawn Taylor: [00:52:38] Oh, that's hilarious. No, you can text me any time, and I will always respond.

Jason Tieri: [00:52:42] Yeah, at least respond back like I'm good or Can't do it. People that leave me hanging after they ask a question, it's just like...

Dawn Taylor: [00:52:50] That's my biggest pet peeve. So here's my, here's my like, Hi, how are you? And then you're like, Good, how are you? And then, like, they don't respond. And you're like, Hello, were we not in an engaging conversation?

Jason Tieri: [00:53:04] Right? Yeah. I said, How are you, damn it. Just say great. And then we can be done with this interchange.

Dawn Taylor: [00:53:11] Oh, it's so true. Jason, this was so fun. Let's jump into some rapid fire questions.

Jason Tieri: [00:53:20] All right, let's do it.

Dawn Taylor: [00:53:21] What is your favorite place you've ever traveled?

Jason Tieri: [00:53:24] Oh, actually, it's Mexico, and it's actually a poor area of Mexico. I did a couple of mission trips in Colima, Mexico. It's dirt poor down there. A couple of orphanages. That was actually my favorite place. It was such a cool place to be where it wasn't vacation Mexico, which I've been. But it was just cool, like just the life there and just the slowness of everybody. And they're just like, Man, what's up? And I don't know. I loved it there, so.

Dawn Taylor: [00:53:55] Oh, that is so cool. And I have to Google that one. Describe yourself in one sentence.

Jason Tieri: [00:54:01] I'll love you hard, but sometimes I'm an asshole.

Dawn Taylor: [00:54:07] That's. That works. That's my husband. I always joke that there's an extra love language and it's abuse. Like in a verbal like, like not like a physical abuse, but like, like jumping around sarcasm, asshole. I always joke that that's my husband's love language. And he's like mmhmm.

Jason Tieri: [00:54:26] I love it.

Dawn Taylor: [00:54:27] Yeah. The more he picks on you, the more he loves you. He's been that way as long as I've known him. What is something you spend a silly amount of money on?

Jason Tieri: [00:54:36] Oh, gosh. Monster energy.

Dawn Taylor: [00:54:39] Really? Like, how many a day? How many a day are you drinking?

Jason Tieri: [00:54:43] So I do drink the sugar free ones. Not that that matters. At least I'm not putting empty calories, they're probably a cancerous. I drank two a day, but two every day, like I order it by the case on Amazon. It's nuts. It's like two cases a month.

Dawn Taylor: [00:54:59] That is crazy.

Jason Tieri: [00:55:01] Dude. Yeah, it's a problem. And it's not even the caffeine. I love the taste. I don't know what they put in there. The same person that makes the chips that make them taste so good and crunchy - like there's a crunch person, right, so you eat more of them - works for Monster Energy too, because, like, I don't need the caffeine. I mean, I just drink them because they're delicious. They are like my favorite drink.

Dawn Taylor: [00:55:25] Oh, that is too funny. I don't even know the last time I had a Monster energy drink. That's wild.

Jason Tieri: [00:55:31] Man.

Dawn Taylor: [00:55:32] What is an unusual habit or an absurd thing that you love?

Jason Tieri: [00:55:37] Oh, man, I know they're supposed to be rapid fire, but...

Dawn Taylor: [00:55:40] No, it's okay.

Jason Tieri: [00:55:43] An unusual habit or something that I love. So you actually, and this don't, don't be sad people when you hear this, but you talked about the scabs. And I like applying a little bit of pain to myself. A little bit. And it's a weird habit, but like, I have this little, like, thing on my thumb that I pick at. And it's a weird habit, but it actually brings me a little bit of relief. I don't know what it is. I'm sure, I'm like not a cutter or anything, that would be too much pain for me, that kind of stuff. But like, I've talked to my therapist about it and I was like, Should I stop this? And she's like, No, I mean, if it goes to the next level, yeah, but no, you're good. So that's a weird habit. I just kind of like, the scabs, oh, my gosh my wife wants to smack me so hard. She's like, Don't you pick that. I'm like, I just kind of like the pain.

Dawn Taylor: [00:56:35] That's so funny. But it's the same as the people that love getting tattoos. Is often - and I've seen this a lot with clients over the years - it's often when you've had to shut off all of your feels and your emotions, even a negative feel gives you a feel, but it allows you to control it. So it's a way of feeling something.

Jason Tieri: [00:56:56] So right. You're controlling your own pain. Now, tattooing, which I do have a lot of tattoos, there are some areas where I'm not controlling it. I don't like it because it's in a sensitive area, but for the most part it's like you've signed up for this. So yeah, it's kind of controlled pain, so interesting.

Dawn Taylor: [00:57:12] But it allows you to actually just feel a feel. And especially when especially when traumas happened within your family, because then there's this weird attachment to like, the people that should have loved you the most, hurt you the most, and where you should have been the happiest was where you were hurt the most. So then people get scared to actually feel happy feels and positive feels. So then there becomes this really interesting attachment to pain.

Jason Tieri: [00:57:37] Yeah, it's so weird.

Dawn Taylor: [00:57:38] Something about it that actually feels good. No, it's, it's actually not, I mean, to me, it's not absurd, but that's because I see this every day in work. And I've done it, but yeah. No, that's amazing. One last one. If you could choose anywhere in the world to live, where would it be?

Jason Tieri: [00:57:54] I know this sounds cliche, but I love where I live. Like, I don't... I love it so much. It's a great community. And yes, the winters can be shitty, but like, I'm so blessed to be in an area where I get spring and summer and fall and winter and it's just, I just love it here.

Dawn Taylor: [00:58:12] Because where do you live?

Jason Tieri: [00:58:13] I live in Grand Rapids, like West Michigan, on the biggest freshwater lake, you know, ever. I think it's the biggest one in the country. I don't know. Probably not the world, but, so I'm like 30 minutes from the lake and everything's, I don't know. It's great over here. So, and I'm kind of a homebody. I was gone in Dallas last week and I'm like, this sucks. I cannot wait to get, I mean, it was good to be there, but I'm just like, I can't wait to be in my home, my own house. And yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:58:43] You just wanted to be home.

Jason Tieri: [00:58:44] I just want to be home. Yeah.

Dawn Taylor: [00:58:47] That's awesome. No, I love it. So, Jason, thank you again for being here today. Thank you for hanging out and talking about relationships and adult relationships and why they're hard and where it all kind of started, right, when you weren't raised even knowing what a healthy adult relationship was. So if you want to find Jason, check out his podcast, it is outstanding, at Threads podcast. He is at Jason Tiere - t i e r i - dot com. He's on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, all of your normal places. Go drop him a like, a follow, a subscription, something, and check out our show notes if you want to find any of the things that we chatted about today at TheTaylorWay.ca. We will see you again in a couple of weeks.

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